Device Increases MPG and Lowers Emissions.

[siddy]

Excuse the double posting, i did't like the original title ;)

http://www.canada.com/montreal/montrealgazette/news/story.html?id=cfeb17de-d945-4db4-87a6-090911200e96&page=1

"It" is his Hydrogen Generating Module, or H2N-Gen for short.

Smaller than a DVD player - small enough to sit comfortably under the hood of any truck or car - it could be big enough to solve the world's greenhouse gas emission problems, at least for the near future. In fact, it could make the Kyoto protocol obsolete. Basically, the H2N-Gen contains a small reservoir of distilled water and other chemicals such as potassium hydroxide. A current is run from the car battery through the liquid. This process of electrolysis creates hydrogen and oxygen gases which are then fed into the engine's intake manifold where they mix with the gasoline vapours.....

Williams claims he has achieved this with his H2N-Gen. His product, he said, produces a more complete burn, greatly increasing efficiency and reducing fuel consumption by 10 to 40 per cent - and pollutants by up to 100 per cent.

Most internal combustion engines operate at about 35 per cent efficiency. This means that only 35 per cent of the fuel is fully burned. The rest either turns to carbon corroding the engine or goes out the exhaust pipe as greenhouse gases.

If this is true, and works, it might be the best thing for cars since the fuel injector.

[Captain Colon]

35% efficiency doesn't mean that 35% of fuel is burned, it means that only 35% of the energy created is actually transmitted to the drivetrain. If all the fuel didn't burn then the unburnt fuel would clog up your exhaust.

I call bullshit, especially on the "reduces pollutants by up to 100%" rofl


*E* Not to say it wouldn't do ANYTHING if it actually works, but the logic behind the touted benefits is flawed.

[Bone_Vulture]

The article emphasises fully burned, similar to a fire creating either carbon dioxide or carbon monoxide depending on the amount of oxygen available. Also notice the magic phrase up to 100% less pollutants, which is probably achieved when the engine is switched off. :rolleyes:

Anyways, my knowledge on combustion engines is farely limited. That gadget could work, or not.

[Captain Colon]

The article emphasises fully burned, similar to a fire creating either carbon dioxide or carbon monoxide depending on the amount of oxygen available.
Didn't think of that :(


I wonder how hard it is to install on cars...since they all have systems that take some exhaust gasses and run them back through the combustion chambers again to cut down on emissions.

As far as lowering emissions it looks promising, but I can't see how it would really increase fuel efficiency (from the article it looks like it gets about the same mileage, if not a little less)

[Modest Genius]

edit: im an idiot, didnt read the article properly

soooo, all it is is an electrolysis cell which enriches the air intake? seems a bit strange, since its halfway to being a fuel cell without actually using it to power the car, but enhance petrol usage

[Captain Colon]

It looks like it's more to decrease emissions than actually decrease fuel usage, since the emissions seem to be the only figure with a marked change (from 5.5grams/km to 0)

[Bone_Vulture]

soooo, all it is is an electrolysis cell which enriches the air intake? seems a bit strange, since its halfway to being a fuel cell without actually using it to power the car, but enhance petrol usage

I thought a fuel cell is supposed to turn hydrogen into energy... Zuh?

[Modest Genius]

yup. but to charge it up at a 'fuel' station it needs to be able to do the opposite. unless someone finds some super-duper way of pumping hydrogen around without blowing everything up, fuel cells are just ultra high density batteries

[[Political] Slayer]

The average truck will save $7,500 in 8 months? Shit, I wont burn that much fuel in 6 years even at $3.00 a gallon, and I have a gas loving, old, tired truck that goes 300 miles on $60 in gas, I think they overemphasized a bit.

[siddy]

Slayer']The average truck will save $7,500 in 8 months? Shit, I wont burn that much fuel in 6 years even at $3.00 a gallon, and I have a gas loving, old, tired truck that goes 300 miles on $60 in gas, I think they overemphasized a bit.

Unless you drive a transport truck, that sentence need not apply to you.

[Bone_Vulture]

yup. but to charge it up at a 'fuel' station it needs to be able to do the opposite. unless someone finds some super-duper way of pumping hydrogen around without blowing everything up, fuel cells are just ultra high density batteries

I wonder what sort of a rig you'd have to build in the car to electrolysize (however it's spelled) water into hydrogen, and then have it stored in a fuel tank either pressurized or in liquid form. :confused:

[Captain Colon]

Something wholly impractical and extremely dangerous, I suspect.

[Redoubts]

So... this is a catalytic converter replacement?

[Paluch]

Its not dangerous, if he keeps the O2 and H2 separate. Some of you need to read up what electrolysis is, because there is no need to store the hydrogen. The hydrogen is created on demand. When you need to REFUEL it you just fill it up with distilled water.

[Bone_Vulture]

Its not dangerous, if he keeps the O2 and H2 separate. Some of you need to read up what electrolysis is, because there is no need to store the hydrogen. The hydrogen is created on demand. When you need to REFUEL it you just fill it up with distilled water.

I was answering to Modest's post.

[Daywalker]

indeed, this article doesn't seem to understand how engines work. Gasoline just doesn't magically turn into carbon or greenhouse gases when it doesn't get burned.


this does look interesting though.


this thing aparently hurts gas mileage.

[Grunt]

Reminds me of claims of those claimed "super carburetors"

[pro kossu]

My Bullshit sense is tingling. How hard it would've been to prove that the thing works?

[Captain Colon]

My Bullshit sense is tingling. How hard it would've been to prove that the thing works?
Well it says they hooked it up to an EGA...I don't see how the exhaust pipe could be cool like they said though...even if you burned everything including the byproducts, that would just make MORE heat that has to go somewhere.

[Agent Law]

Wouldn't that mean you just have it use less fuel per cycle?

[Modest Genius]

I wonder what sort of a rig you'd have to build in the car to electrolysize (however it's spelled) water into hydrogen, and then have it stored in a fuel tank either pressurized or in liquid form. :confused:well, on the electrolysis bit, a tank of distilled water with two metal walls to act as electrodes. hardly complicated. hell, every school does it in a beaker with two metal sticks to show the hydrogen test...

storage looks like being in some ultrabsorbant carbon or ceramic material, so neither gas nor liquid, and thats the hard and expensive bit thats getting all the research right now

[Daywalker]

well, on the electrolysis bit, a tank of distilled water with two metal walls to act as electrodes. hardly complicated. hell, every school does it in a beaker with two metal sticks to show the hydrogen test...

storage looks like being in some ultrabsorbant carbon or ceramic material, so neither gas nor liquid, and thats the hard and expensive bit thats getting all the research right now


and you need a power source to generate the electricity for the electrolysis, so we still have the problem of how to create clean energy.

[Modest Genius]

exactly.

however, burning oil or gas in a power station is already FAR more efficient than in a car, even allowing for the loses in distribution

[Lord Kelvin]

I've seen news about supposed "hydrogen cars," but I think those ran purely on hydrogen instead of hybrid-ing. This looks too good to be true; besides, if it were this wonderful, it would probably be all over the news, if not exactly headline.

[Agent Law]

Hydrogen cars are old news, though. Stories like disaster and all that stuff is shocking and those headlines sell. It has to be an incredibly slow day for news to be making a big story out of scientific developments.

[Lord Kelvin]

Hydrogen cars are old news, though. Stories like disaster and all that stuff is shocking and those headlines sell. It has to be an incredibly slow day for news to be making a big story out of scientific developments.
I can understand that, but if this new gizmo is as revolutionary as it says, then it would probably be in the news, even just as an aside; after all, they still find time to mention soaring gas prices despite all the action in Iraq and Afghanistan.