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Tori Storm
February 13th, 2009, 12:11 PM
strategic cruisers: a new breed

reported by CCP Nozh

“glitter is the herpes of craft supplies”

Demetri Martin, because everyone else is using quotes.

As we enter our sixth sprint, titled Superion, team "T3ch" is still working relentlessly towards its goals. Having accomplished a lot in previous sprints (named Magnaboss, Voltron, Zeta Gundam, and Devastator) things are going smoothly. For many of us, this is our first time working within a scrum team and the operation has been very successful so far.

Team "T3ch" consists of Tuxford and 2Kay from software, Lemur and Dionysus assuring quality, Chiliad, our “Product Owner”, finally Chronotis and I heading up the designs. As can be gleaned from the team name, our primary task is introducing Tech 3 but we're also working on a new and improved fitting screen, mechanics that allow you to save and share your setups and of course, the eternal task of general improvements and bugfixing. In this blog you’ll get a short summary of the dark delights of Tech 3 ships




Strategic Cruisers

The elation of happening upon a unique fit, some fresh and clever setup, has always been a very appealing aspect of EVE. One of our primary goals for the Tech 3 ships was to bring this customization to a whole new level. The new ships are a fundamental departure from the tried and tested, offering such unparalleled customization that discussing them on the same terms as previous ships belies their true extent - we're talking full-fledged, independent systems within the system. A little bit scary, really. They are called Strategic Cruisers, where "strategic" refers to the internal scalability and dynamic nature of the setup options- not a battlefield role like coordinators or command ships. Of course, they can align beautifully with virtually any fleet on any mission, but just as well prowl as lone wolves.


http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/9858/mc5mv1tfh6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)



Concept Art, Minmatar Strategic Cruiser.




Subsystems

To assemble a Strategic Cruiser you need a hull (the base ship chassis) and 5 subsystems:

Electronic Subsystem - Modifies all the electronic related stats, such as CPU, sensor strength, targeting.

Defensive Subsystem - Determines the general "toughness" of the ship, how much damage it is capable of taking or how hard its outer shell is. It will also scale the cargohold and dronebay.

Offensive Subsystem - Will be able to modify hardpoints, launcher slots, give different damage bonuses as well as control the drone bandwidth.

Engineering Subsystem - Powergrid, capacitor as well as special racial role bonuses and other core functions.

Propulsion Subsystem - Determines speed and agility.


Subsystems not only change the ship's attributes, slot layout and bonuses, but the geometrical shape and appearance as well. As stated, each vessel consists of 5 subsystems and a hull. Once the ship has been assembled, players are free to switch out the subsystems completely at will, given they are docked at a station. Each subsystem category has multiple possible variations. Within a single category the available variations do not go from worst to best according to expenditure, but instead have their complimentary strengths and weaknesses. This way, every single subsystem combination will be allowed, whereas with a "bigger is better" approach we'd have had to restrict certain combinations, lest the most expensive combination render all the others moot.

Now, if we just take a moment to consider that every subsystem configuration is available on each of the four different ships, what we end up with is a total number of variations reaching into the literal thousands - and that's before you fit it. This might almost seem daunting, but hopefully careful implementation and a lucid interface will ease you into the spiraling complexities of this whole new ship breed.




Skills

The Tech 3 entry level will be very similar to the Tech 2 one, only requiring fairly basic skills to pilot. Of course, additional skills will be required to fully utilize the different subsystems.

Each race will have a set of 5 subsystem skills as well as a ship skill. The subsystem skills have very basic requirements and are only "rank 1". These affect the subsystem bonuses. Don't think we decided to have them rank 1 just to be cordial though; they don't function like other skills when it comes to ship loss. This is important: Due to the sudden rift in the symbiotic ship relationship that exists between a pilot and a Tech 3 ship, losing a Tech 3 ship will result in a random skillpoint loss from one of the racial subsystem skills. The penalty is one level off the top. Observe that whether that is a downgrade from, say, level 2 to 1 on your underdeveloped electronics or a painful fall from level 5 to 4 on the spit-polished offensive subsystem, is entirely dependent upon lady luck. Ejecting or self-destructing does prevent the penalty, giving players an incentive to abandon ship from time to time.




Balancing

The initial struggle of birthing behind us, we've finally come to the point where we can begin balancing the subsystems. Joining me for these emotional first steps is a familiar face to many of you, the one and only TomB.

In the grand scheme of things we want Tech 3 ships to take a much broader role than any other ship class. Whereas Tech 2 ships are highly focused, Tech 3 ships will fulfill multiple roles through customization and versatility.

Seeing as how every variation of all 5 subsystems has to be carefully granted advantages and disadvantages with due consideration to how it combines with all the others (sigh...), a long and arduous balancing act lies ahead. Player scrutiny and feedback will be a great asset to us while balancing the Legion, Proteus, Tengu and Loki (the four Tech 3 ship classes). We hope that most of you will assist in bringing about the monumental leap to the next generation.



From here?

Chronotis will enlighten you about Tech 3 production in his upcoming blog, Tuxford or 2kay will undoubtedly want to inform you all about the mechanics that lurk behind the scenes. As we're going to be relying much upon player feedback, you can expect seeing the Strategic Cruisers on Singularity soon. All I can say now is, welcome to the wonderful world of interstellar Lego.



Nozh.
http://myeve.eve-online.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=629

D0INK
February 13th, 2009, 12:21 PM
The whole "losing a random skill upon ship loss" is going to prevent me from bothering to get the skills past 3 quite frankly (depending on the skill rank, though).

I'm going to leave the rest of my opinions to myself until I know more about tech 3 and the components (with regards to the actual numbers)

Tori Storm
February 13th, 2009, 12:23 PM
youll lose one level from one of the 5 subsystem skills. The subsystem skills will be rank 1.

D0INK
February 13th, 2009, 12:41 PM
If they're rank 1, I'll probably level them all up to 4 because they should be relatively quick trains.

Kirex
February 14th, 2009, 01:23 AM
My concerns are there wont be enough variation between the sub systems, and they'll be too expensive to use in pvp and only be collecting dust in stations.

Deadi9
February 14th, 2009, 01:58 AM
I like the incentive there for pilots to eject rather than lose a skill point thing. :)

Jan'z Kolna
February 14th, 2009, 05:51 AM
I think t3 ship prices will depend on how accessible W-space will be, and how much salvage one can get from sleeper ships
new devblog is up, they mentioned something about limiting some aspects of t3 production to lowsec/nullsec
they pulled brand new manufacturing tree, just like with rigs, but more complicated
nothing about wormholes probeable (or not) in hi-sec, no numbers, no skills listed

I hope we won't end up with t3 cost comparable to marauders

gonna log on Sisi to see what' up, then watch out for next , more detailed devblogs

BattleWhack
February 14th, 2009, 02:45 PM
I won't be bothering with T3 for a long time, I think. I may train the skills in case I make someone eject from one, but I'll stick to zealots for my expensive glass cannons.

Pulsar Solaris
February 14th, 2009, 09:11 PM
I hope they cost fuck tons too. If it was just some other ship to pimp out and sink 3 months of skills at L5 into, it wouldn't be special. It's just be a new T2 ship. Get the fuck over it. Eve has always been about losing shit and risk. That's why it's fun. If you don't want risk, please, please, please, please, PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE quit the game and go play WoW.

Kirex
February 14th, 2009, 09:30 PM
Well you're an idiot. :D
If they're just a little bit better than T2, why spend hundreds of million ISK more?

Gruxella
February 14th, 2009, 09:34 PM
can i play warhammer instead? i fucking hate wow

Pulsar Solaris
February 14th, 2009, 09:35 PM
Who said they're be just a little bit better? And you think they should be super cheap, and pretty much just some new ship added to the game with a spiffy new name? Yeah, that's really exciting. And I'm the idiot?

Splitlip
February 14th, 2009, 11:16 PM
If the shoe fits, fucking kill yourself with it.

Gruxella
February 15th, 2009, 12:04 AM
do we know how to build these yet? I'm willing to go hardcore and make ald build them and run plexes/etc with grape/grux and others.

Jan'z Kolna
February 15th, 2009, 12:42 AM
Gas+mins =polymer
polymer+sleeper salvage = component
ancient relic+reverse engineering = BPC

component+BPC = hull
component+BPC = subsystem

hull+subsystem = t3 ship

throw in new reactions, new POS modules, new datacores ,new skills
dunno if new cores/skills will be seeded on market or one will need exploration to acquire them
overall, looks like big investment :)

BattleWhack
February 15th, 2009, 02:40 AM
Yeah, sounds like its going to be a bitch.

Kirex
February 15th, 2009, 02:55 AM
Who said they're be just a little bit better? And you think they should be super cheap, and pretty much just some new ship added to the game with a spiffy new name? Yeah, that's really exciting. And I'm the idiot?

Yeah I think you're an idiot. ;o

I said IF they're just a little bit better than t2, they won't be worth the ISK. I did NOT say I wanted them to be "super cheap", but I want them to be WORTH the ISK they'll be going for. I want a T2 ship to fair against a T3 ship just as well as a T1 ship would fair against their T2 counterpart.

I hope I cleared up the confusion... :S

D0INK
February 15th, 2009, 01:31 PM
Jeez. Jan'z Kolna is all up in this bitch. Looks like someone has been doing their internet spaceship homework.

Jan'z Kolna
February 15th, 2009, 03:20 PM
little investment in rigs and invention when they first come out got me a machariel and couple of snake sets,
and all that w/o vertical integration

unfortunately, t3 production seems to be out of my league :(

D0INK
February 15th, 2009, 07:18 PM
I really meant that seriously by the way. That wasn't sarcasm.

Also, are they seriously placing a ship's availability based off of exploration and salvage? They'll be expensive as fuck just basing it off of that.

BattleWhack
February 15th, 2009, 11:31 PM
Scrapheap seems to think they won't be worth the effort at the moment.

Jan'z Kolna
February 16th, 2009, 05:57 AM
http://myeve.eve-online.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=623

Gruxella
February 16th, 2009, 06:47 AM
i'm still going to build them who will help

Jan'z Kolna
February 16th, 2009, 02:20 PM
my alt is highly skilled inventor/manufacturer, my main is explorer
Alderith Inc. as t3 building corp y/n?

Pulsar Solaris
February 16th, 2009, 05:41 PM
Yeah I think you're an idiot. ;o

I said IF they're just a little bit better than t2, they won't be worth the ISK. I did NOT say I wanted them to be "super cheap", but I want them to be WORTH the ISK they'll be going for. I want a T2 ship to fair against a T3 ship just as well as a T1 ship would fair against their T2 counterpart.

I hope I cleared up the confusion... :S

Well I sure as fuck hope they're awesome ships too. Just not solowtfpwnmobiles. But no really expensive ships are truely worth it in Eve. Is a Vindicator really worth a bil? Do you go around taking out 4-5 BS or a Carriers on your own? Do Firetails take out fleets of frigates? Do Ashimmus take down Devoters and Onyxes? No. But they're fucking cool. Which is what T3 ships are going to be too. That still doesn't mean they should break the mold of ship pricing. If T1 shit is cheap, T2 gets fucking expensive, T3 should break the goddamn bank.

friedCrumpet
February 16th, 2009, 07:55 PM
i'm still going to build them who will help

I'm keen, although I think I will be mostly keen on exploring the wormholes.

Here's a nice friendly chart on T3 production. Looks like a major PITA.

http://dl.eve-files.com/media/0902/TechIIIProd.jpg

And just from reading the blog it will require POS structures for most parts of the production process, so it's not a light investment. Still I think it might be profitable to even participate in part of the process (say reacting the polymers).

Xonja 2zero
February 21st, 2009, 12:46 PM
Ships seem to be getting closer to final, bonuses working on Sisi now:

http://eve-search.com/thread/1003629

About the ISK value, everything in EVE is about diminishing returns. ISK value goes up waaaay faster than use value.

Jan'z Kolna
February 23rd, 2009, 05:19 PM
regarding tech3 production, only manufacturing polymers is limited to lowsec
everything else can be done in hisec

so, what's isk cost and timeframe for setting up small POS in empire?

some guy on eve-o estimates t3 cost as comparable to marauders, and I think he's right.

about piloting a Loki.... it seems some thinking outside the box required , it's ship with 6 boni, not just t2 on steroids
come to Sisi, see for yourself - some cool stuff like t2 web with 25km range :)